A recent discussion about the princely salary paid to we men of Annapolis following graduation led to http://www.dfas.mil/money/milpay/priorpay/ and the answer (no prior service/special pay) of $222.30 in base pay, $47.88 in BAS and $85.50/$68.40 in BAQ (married/single).

Warmest Aloha from Hawaii . . .

George Stott

Sorry, George, my recollection is $75 married - exactly what the crook charged that 'allowed' Nancy and me to inhabit his reconditioned, (and small!), garage.

R - ed

What do you think a new Ensign received as monthly pay when we were Plebes? Ans: Check attachment.....it is taken from our Reef Points. Have a great weekend.

Steve (1)

Steve...that pay scale didn't increase dramatically from our plebe reef points to our commissioning. If I recall, our base pay as O-1's was $222.30...that number seems to stick with me like the laundry number and file number. Can anyone confirm?

You can go to http://www.dfas.mil/money/milpay/priorpay.htm and you will find all the military pay charts from 1949 until now. They are in pdf format, which requires Adobe's Acrobat Reader to view them. Acrobat Reader is available free on most web pages that use it.

All Hands,

Flight pay was $100 per month. Then, because of a three year service obligation, the pay made a quantum jump. I had three years in the reserves in Milwaukee, so I collected over a thousand dollar check after petitioning for the three years' longevity in the reserve. That was along about November of '55, so do the math. I was the envy of everbody in my squadron group at Saufley Field.

Wonder what flight pay is now?

Barry Bowen (4)

It fits with my memory. In fact, it went into effect, I think, 1/c summer, and as 1/c we got a gross of 1/2 that amount, less all kinds of deductions, for a net of (?) $17.00.

Bingy Moore (4)

I remember 220. That is what I tell my wife, kids and grandchildren. However, you are probably absolutely correct as I round everything off as unnecessary anyway.

bud

Hey, Bud...in the '50's that 30 cents didn't get rounded off in my checkbook deposits...by the time the end of the month rolled around, we were fat, dumb and happy to have that much left over to spend on the Base movie at 25 cents!

Pat

You are correct. Our first base pay was $222.30 and we got $47.88 chow allowance (BAS). As Midshipmen, we had been getting half that, $111.15 - no BAS. I believe we got a Seaman's pay as Plebes and Youngsters.

Harv

Roger that! And flight pay was $100. 45%.

Burt Munger (17)

As Plebes and Youngsters we got $3.00 a month, cash money. A $1 and a $2 bill. I still have one of the $2 bills.

Burt

I believe we got $7.00 youngster year, our "monthly insult."

Bingy Moore (4)

Pat,
Oh, yeah . . . the Fifties! I remember the $222.30 (or was it 36¢?). After I get through sending a check to Annapolis Banking and Trust for the monthly on the '55 Ford Customline with the I-block Six, I had $90 left for me (and the $45 mess bill). The rest was for swinging.

Len

Bingy,

I seem to remember $5 youngster and $7 2/c years. I think we would have gotten $9 as firsties but there was a pay raise for the military 1/c summer so we got more, but I don't remember how much.

Len

The thing I remember most about our O-1 payroll figure (non-flight) was a net amount of $240.00. The kindly BOQ maid who cleaned up the rooms at Oxnard AFB got $270. The other thing I remember is that my friends who had stayed home in the Navy Reserve, and were commissioned at the same time we were, drew the $75 bump for their 3+ years of "seniority".

Tom...that "net amount" included some BAQ if you were not shipboard...$220.30 was basic pay... the annual income tax statement for those ensigns up in the BOQ while their ship as in overhaul hit $2880...while those of us "real sailors" embarked and payi ng a monthly mess bill of $30 on the big flagships...we were seeing something slightly under $2700 on the year's end taxable income.

Pat

I think Len is 'right on', re our "take home" pay as mids...and if I recall...it was a measely $3 per month as plebes...just enough to buy a fresh can of shoe polish and a new desk blotter every 4 months...and maybe take in the Circle Theater once every 6 months (if you weren't marching it off every weekend!)

Pat

Len...I knew you were a "swinger" from the start...but I didn't know you had that kind of money to make it as an ensign...... 'course, I spent my whole first year at sea on a cruiser flagship...much of it in the Med...where an occasional liberty allowed m e the opportunity to blow my paycheck on 3 peseta Fundidor cognac...

Meanwhile, there were tales back home of some guy who wiggled his hips, and a recent college grad (Columbia 1955) by the name of Pat Boone, who crooned all the gals from teeny-boppers to college coeds...it was tough making out unless you were in Pensacola where I understand the sweet things gathered in order to catch a brand new pilot with flight skins...now they lived HIGH for the '50's!!!

Burt...if you only got an even $100 for flight skins...you shoulda' gone to New London instead of Pensacola...I think we got $110 as basic Sub (hazardous duty) Pay!!!

Pat

Pat,
I gotta admit . . . my Dad made sure I got to the Circle Theater more often than twice a year. He wrote often and generously.

Len

Pat...I didn't get to Pensacola till about five years ago. About the only "swinging" I do now is in the old Pauley's Island hammock.

Len

Pat, The $3.00 was the only cash money we got, however we had a charge account at the mid store where we could get all the misc stuff like tooth paste, razor blades, etc. I think you could also charge steerage coupons. Don't remember, but there must have been some limit. As I remember the midshipman's pay was calculated upon a basis that if you used the maximum of this limit plus laundry, meals uniform shop, etc. over the four years you would still have enough in your account at graduation to purchase a complete uniform and outfitting. The calculation for our class on this basis, not only was there no balance left for such outfitting, we were going to be in considerable debt. That is why they changed the pay scale to half an ensign's pay but for our class it was too little too late. We were lucky if we broke even which many of us were not.

Bob Miller (16)

I recall a series something like this

Plebe year $3.00 (which didn't last very long at the steerage)

Youngster year $5.00

2nd Class year $7.00 Bill Anders and I had to hitch hike back from Philly after the Princeton game. The $7.00 didn't go very far either. That was the first time either of us had taken a weekend.) 1st Class year $13.00

I remember $222 per month. With nothing to do with it (no car payments, living on the ship,etc.) by June 1956 when Maudie and I got married, I had saved $1200.00. Bought a fill up the oil, and check the gas car (1950 Ford) for $600.00. Three weeks late r we were married. Two weeks after that the other $600 was blown and we were pay check to pay check until 1962.

When I stopped paying the bachelor tax we got a $95.00 per month pay raise.

Fred Underwood (22)

And here is my first NAVY PAY chit that I never cashed in. [Maybe the Defense Budget has been out of balance by $3 all these years.] Now that I have a Reef Points (thanks to John Roberts), I'm going to paste it in as I begin assembling my Plebe Kit (at B utter's suggestion).

I note that in the upper left is a "File or service number." It shows that mine was 672. This is the first time I've noticed it. Every time I have had to give a number for my service at USNA, I've given my laundry number which was 443. Was 672 my Serv ice Number?
Jerry (20)

I remember our monthly "allowances" we got as Mids in the 4 years .... 4/c: $3, 3/c: $7, 2/c: $9, 1/c: $13.

I think our starting Midn pay was $78/month, same as an E-1. When our class graduated (on Thompson Field)....(just kidding), most of us were in the red and owed our debts to the Navy, due to our lavish swinging USNA life style. Base pay for O-1 was $22 2 and for O-2 was $272. (OK, probably add 30 cents).

New Marines went to Quantico for Basic School, where we found out that the NROTC got all their uniforms free, and the PLCs (Platoon Leaders Class) got 3 years longevity when we all got commissioned. We were miffed by those fun- loving college guys havin g perks while we "Mid-coolies" started out our careers in bondage with our debts. Actually, to be fair, we got good educations for free. BTW - a NROTC guy that I had got to know pretty well on our 3/c and 1/c summer cruises was in my platoon and quanset hut, and we shared one of the steel double upper/lower bunks. He later became a U S Senator from Calif, then Governor of Calif...Pete Wilson.

I had always wanted to invest in the stock market, but never could afford it. In the 1st Mar Div I wound up in Force Recon Co, went to 2 good Army schools ...Jump School at Ft Benning and Special Forces School at Ft Bragg, so got that extra jump pay of $ 110. In those days ('57) that was big money for jr officers, so finally got my savings up to $1,000 and could make my first investment. No war was on by then (had more guts than brains), so got out in '59 and went into Reserve Units for 3 more years, t hen 4 more Inactive Reserves, then finally out. I made a good career in Merrill Lynch for 31 years, then retired.

An e-mail yesterday someone mentioned buying "Fundidor" brandy. It's from Spain as I recall. When I was in the Med in '58-'59 in a Marine Detachment aboard USS Randall (CVA 15) we had good liberty ports, a lot better than WesPac. Bought some of that Fu ndidor in Barcelona ("Chris" Columbus' port of departure in 1492). I think we paid equilalent of about 40 cents for Fundidor, probably a liter. It was the the worst rot-gut I can remember. A close second was some cheap champaign in Athens, also about 40 cents U S.
Re Marine Detachments...I enjoyed my duties except one: brig officer. Nothing good ever comes from these jobs, they say. Luckily, I had no problems. When the Air Group was aboard I often went on liberty with some pilots, and had some interesting advent ures with those brown-shoes. We lost too many aircraft during our 7 month deployment, and unfortunately several pilots too. The term "Pilot Error" was used as most of the accidents were not solved. Also the CAG was not a great role-model for his pilots ; he was arrested one night in a liberty port brawl, and the Air Boss or the Skipper had to get him out of jail. The pilots had many sayings as I recall, i e: "These planes are designed by PhDs, built by masters degrees, flown by bachelor degrees, and ma intained by high-school degrees"; and the old saying "There are old pilots and there are bold pilots, but there are no old bold pilots".

One last item re combat flying...as you may know, the Air Force "Wild Weasel" pilots in Viet Nam had extremely risky missions. They flew F-100s, then the better F-105s. They were to fly 100 missions before being relieved, but apparently most were killed , wounded, or downed and taken POW. Their missions were to be decoys for deadly new Russians SAMs that were targeting and destroying many of our attack planes. These decoys had to make violent maneuvers in split- seconds to evade these (mach 3 1/2) SAM s. The History channel on TV has a one hour program. I've seen it twice...interviews with some surviving pilots, combat films of their tactics, etc. It is outstanding. Leo Thorsen, their expert leader (he became a POW in the Hanoi Hilton) earned the Medal of Honor. We have at least one of our classmates that was in these deadly duels...it would be interesting to hear about these missions from him or other Weasels involved.

Bob Price ( LN # 562) ("P F C")

Bob...enjoyed your recollections, But...Fundidor was...is -in no way, "rot gut"...the best Spanish Brandy on the market, probably sells for at least $10-$12 a bottle nowadays.

It was supposed to be sipped in a small 3 oz snifter shaped glass in the pubs along the "Ramblas" in downtown Barcelona...not swigged in a foxhole or ready room!!!

My first sub skipper took the three most junior JO's over on our first liberty in B'clona to teach us how to drink Fundidor. Lined up at the bar...three jgs's listened while this salty Lcdr spoke: " First, clear your throats, gents...swallow any spit in y our mouth before raising the glass to your lips", he instructed. "Take a generous sip...but don't swallow...like this", he went on...(he did swallow, so he could continue his lesson) - "Let that sip invade every pore in your mouth...swill it around in fr ont of your teeth and up on the roof of your mouth" ..."then...swallow it all...and before you say a word- clench your teeth and suck in a healthy breath of air between your lips."

"Now, you fellows try it...just like I said." (Notice...not like he did!)

Suffice it to say, the three of us had tears in our eyes - a burning esophagus, and a running cough for the next several minutes!!!

A lesson I had the opportunity to pass on to my JO's some 11 years later when I skippered my first submarine... But rot-gut...? Never

Pat

Bob...you are correct - of course. The $3/month plebe pay was our free spending money for that Circle Theater treat...we could charge the shoe polish and desk blotters at the midshipman store.

Since I didn't receive a pair of binoculars or a sword award upon graduation, I blew what little I had saved in the pay account for a new set of Jake Reed blues and the sword, belt and carrying case... I was given a "head's up" by the XO of the USS Northa mpton (CLC-1), that as "George" ...I'd need all the trimmings for a lot of quarterdeck watches when I reported on board.

Pat

That sounds right, Bob.

Someone else mentioned that we got a pay raise either 1/c year or just before. I forget when it was, but didn't we go from $78/month to $81 or $83/month ( . . . still ½ of an O-1's base pay)?

Len (LN 828, FN 595906)

One classmate, who shall go unnamed, routinely borrowed soap, toothpaste, etc. and never used the mid store. Upon graduation, his credit balance was about $300. As near as I can recall, I owed somewhat more than that upon commissioning!

Also, with no regular bills (other than wardroom mess) living aboard ship as a bachelor routinely "volunteered" for duty while in port, I started building savings quite early. That embarrassment of riches led me to balance my account to zero each month b y sending anything left to St. Joseph's Indian School ... my balance remained close to zero until my 1961 marriage. Money isn't close to everything, but it sure comes in handy now and then!

Joe